In this April 2024 episode of The Ezra Klein Show, host Klein speaks to data scientist Hannah Ritchie about a sustainable future for human life on Earth, discussing progress, innovation, and the obstacles we face.

Does a sustainable future mean sacrificing our current way of life?

For a long time, the prevailing line of environmental thought has favored a 'politics of sacrifice,' in which richer countries must give up what they have, and poorer ones must abandon their aspirations for development.

Some scientists now believe that innovation may point the way through the environmental crisis without the need for massive losses in quality of life.

On his New York Times podcast, journalist and political commentator Ezra Klein talks to experts about the most pressing issues of our day.

Data researcher Hannah Ritchie is Klein's guest on this April 2024 episode of The Ezra Klein Show, which explores the possibility of sustainability without sacrifice and the tools we might use to enable a new green future.